Talk:Classes
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| Novice/Super Novice | |||||
| Novice | Super Novice | ||||
| First Class | |||||
| Swordman | Magician | Archer | Merchant | Thief | Acolyte |
| 2-1 | |||||
| Knight | Wizard | Hunter | Blacksmith | Assassin | Priest |
| 2-1 Transcendent | |||||
| Lord Knight | High Wizard | Sniper | Mastersmith | Assassin Cross | High Priest |
| 2-2 | |||||
| Crusader | Sage | Bard/Dancer | Alchemist | Rogue | Monk |
| 2-2 Transcendent | |||||
| Paladin | Scholar | Minstrel/Gypsy | Biochemist | Stalker | Champion |
| Expanded | |||||
| TaeKwon Kid | Ninja | Gunslinger | |||
| Soul Linker | TaeKwon Master | ||||
In other news, who picked these colors? Christ. Can we get some that people who aren't blind don't find offensive? --Resplendent 20:09, 9 November 2007 (MST)
- I modified it. Do you like it now? Hadas 23:20, 9 November 2007 (MST)
Modified version:
| Novices | |||||||||||
| Novice | Super Novice | ||||||||||
| First Jobs | |||||||||||
| Swordman | Magician | Archer | Merchant | Thief | Acolyte | ||||||
| Second Jobs | |||||||||||
| Knight | Crusader | Wizard | Sage | Hunter | Bard/Dancer | Blacksmith | Alchemist | Assassin | Rogue | Priest | Monk |
| Transcendent Novices | |||||||||||
| High Novice | |||||||||||
| Transcendent First Jobs | |||||||||||
| High First Class | |||||||||||
| Transcendent Second Jobs | |||||||||||
| Lord Knight | Paladin | High Wizard | Scholar | Sniper | Minstrel/Gypsy | Mastersmith | Biochemist | Assassin Cross | Stalker | High Priest | Champion |
| Expanded Jobs | |||||||||||
| TaeKwon Kid | Ninja | Gunslinger | |||||||||
| Soul Linker | TaeKwon Master | ||||||||||
My only concern with both tables is where does High First Class fit in? Colors are a defininite improvement. The font size in yours also seems a little small. --Resplendent 23:34, 9 November 2007 (MST)
- I like the font size on mine. In any case, I adjusted the colors a little bit more and put High First Class and High Novice in. Hadas 07:15, 10 November 2007 (MST)
I hope you guys know exactly where you're going to put third classes in, otherwise this is just pointless... --Deviattor 08:04, 10 November 2007 (MST)
- It depends on what the progression is, whether it's Novice > First Job > Second Job > Third Job, Novice > First Job > Second Job > High Novice > High First Job > Trans Second Job > Third Job. Regardless of which it is, adding another row is not a difficult task. Hadas 08:30, 10 November 2007 (MST)
I made this a while ago. It shows the progressions a bit more clearly... Is it needed? --Steax 03:54, 30 May 2008 (MDT)
A somewhat shorter version could probably do well in the About section. --Resplendent 08:26, 30 May 2008 (MDT)
- Shortened in what manner? Remove the job names themselves? --Steax 19:36, 30 May 2008 (MDT)
- That'd probably help. Anything to keep the page to about the length it is now. --Resplendent 23:42, 30 May 2008 (MDT)
- Ok, I've uploaded a new version without the job names, now just the progression. --Steax 00:33, 1 June 2008 (MDT)
- That'd probably help. Anything to keep the page to about the length it is now. --Resplendent 23:42, 30 May 2008 (MDT)
I think it may be confusing to put the Expanded Classes beneath the Trans Classes. Maybe make it clear which step to choose and which is "Novice", "1st Cls", "2-1 Cls", "2-2 Cls", "Trans 2-1 Cls", "Trans 2-2 Cls", "Expanded", "Special" (SNovi)
since the following version is a bit nasty for low resolution screens, I suggest to make it higher jobs -> horizontally to the right. The euRO homepage got a good picture, but howto put it into a wiki table?
http://www.euro-ro.net/game/chars/
Modified version2:
| Novice | ||||
| Job 10 | Base 45+ | Job 10 | ||
| First Jobs | Special | Expanded Jobs | ||
| Job 40-50 | Job 40-50 | Job 1-99 | Job 40-50 | Job 1-70 |
| Second-1 Jobs | Second-2 Jobs | Expanded Second Jobs | ||
| Base 99 & Job 50 > Rebirth | Job 1-50 | |||
| Transcendent Novices | ||||
| Job 10 | ||||
| Transcendent First Jobs | ||||
| Job 40-50 | Job 40-50 | |||
| Transcendent Second-1 Jobs | Transcendent Second-2 Jobs | |||
| Job 1-70 | Job 1-70 | |||
--Nretep 16:14, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- I'm going to toy around a bit with it to see if it's improvable. Otherwise, looks fine (But a bit too wide?) to me. One thing I'm concerned about is that there is no clearly visible information around here about what is required to move on to the next stage (hence my diagram). I've had people ask me why they shouldn't just become an LK after swordman... --Steax 17:22, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- The Classes.png version is fine and helpful too, but I'm missing SL & TKM. But I'm about to edit the prerequisites into "my" version now.
- Yes it's a bit wide for resolutions <1280. That's why I asked if someone can put it from "up > down" to "left > right" like the original euRO version (linked above) --Nretep 02:49, 13 June 2008 (MDT)
- I've never really understood what SL and TKM fit into. I guess they're expanded, but they seem to be on par with standard 2nd jobs, while people often categorize the expanded classes as fitting somewhere between first and second class. I might try making a horizontal-oriented diagram when I have time. --Steax 04:37, 13 June 2008 (MDT)
- The Classes.png version is fine and helpful too, but I'm missing SL & TKM. But I'm about to edit the prerequisites into "my" version now.
Standardization
I'd like to standardize the Classes pages of every class (not this one) to
Edited after Biochemistness' post
- -About
- -Class Data
- -Base Classes
- -Skills
- -Normal
- -Quest
- -Soul Link
- -Unimplemented
- -Job Bonus
- -ASPD
- -JobChange Guide
- -Stats (what stats do)
- -Builds
- -Build x
- -Stats
- -Applications (Job)
- -Equipment
- -Build y
- -Stats
- -Applications (Job)
- -Equipment
- -Build x
- -Tips and Tricks
- -alternative names
- -External Links
I already prepared alot. I just wanted to ask if anyone got good reasons against it. Thanks --Nretep 16:14, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- Not sure about the kRO/euRO names, as this site is really supposed to be iRO specific. However, I agree the class pages need to be standardized. --Resplendent 16:21, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- There's no euRO Wiki and the official site (side) doesn't really give much informations of the game. So iRO Wiki is alot used by euRO players (like me ...). Some single pages already got kRO names, since there're alot differences in the skill names and sometimes you don't know what somebody is talking about (i.e. iRO Sacrifice = euRO Devotion, but euRO Sacrifice = iRO Martyr's Reckoning). But that's why I asked before I insert all the text I collected --Nretep 16:30, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- Every day I refer people to come to irowiki for reference, and we often have different skill names that makes people confused. I think the skill template should also be slightly modified to add in "alternative names". We should just use that term instead of "kRO names" etc, I think... I agree with this new template. --Steax 17:22, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- There was some discussion a while back (on irc) about having job change guides as separate articles (Sage does a good just of giving a brief overview and linking to full article). Though not much has happened towards that end... but it might be something to consider when doing the class pages. Also, Stats, Equipment used, and applications are often build specific, perhaps a bit more structure to them?
- -Build x
- -Stats
- -Equipment
- -Applications
- -Build y
- -Stats
- -Equipment
- -Applications
- etc.
- This might make the pages longer but it would reflect various subtleties (such as a battle bio not using a bazerald) --Biochemistness-76 19:05, 12 June 2008 (MDT)
- I think it's okay to put the jobchange on the single class page. We're in a time were you don't have to matter with client page loading times just cause of images. But I don't like if to have the jobchange guide at statup. So you'd have to scroll down an unknown number of lines to get any other information. And you just need the guide once or twice yourself. But the "stats" I wrote didn't mean "1 Str, 50 Int, 80Dex ..." but "Strength just increases weight limit. Agi increases ASPD and Flee. Int increases SP and SP rec ...". Because they aren't the same for every class. But for your idea I'd say a section "Builds" as parent of those before you list the single builds.
- a section called "alternative names" sounds fine with me. I prepared most euRO names already. And it'd be even helpful for you if you browse in the net and find another site which says "Paladin Sacrifice Build: 80 Agi". So you can look here and "translate" ii into "iRO language". Just the question about the build template by Biochemistness. --Nretep 02:49, 13 June 2008 (MDT)
- I personally like the 1 STR, 50 INT etc stuff, because for some people new to a certain class, they have no idea how much "a lot" or STR is, etc. Actually, I think it looks best with the range system we have now (e.g. STR: 50-80) because it gives numbers to work off but without making the build so cookie-cutter. Below it we should add info for what each stat is for. On the other hand, a general explanation of why each stat matters for the class as a whole is good. One of my favorite guides ever is Akemi's Monk Guide, which I think is excellent and really covers all the ground needed for anyone who wants to be a monk. I suggest looking at that for an idea for our pages. --Steax
- yes, you're right, but those informations need to be in a spefic build (like in my modified version now) and not as global information about the class as I mentioned. In global class page should be described what this statpoint does for this class (like int DOES increase MAtk for Assassins, but since Assassins don't need MAtk, int just increases SP, SP rec and Soft MDef) --Nretep 05:14, 13 June 2008 (MDT)
- On that I agree. But how do we fill in the existing holes for certain classes? --Steax 10:12, 13 June 2008 (MDT)
- One more thing. First classes don't really need build areas, I guess. We should simply link to the second jobs. Also, since their names seem standard, we don't need an area on alternative names. On second thought, what if we use a different set of standards for the 1st jobs? This set doesn't need stuff like builds, roles, or alternative names. Instead we could put leveling information... Or simply leave the page without those sections. --Steax 04:55, 15 June 2008 (MDT)
- I personally like the 1 STR, 50 INT etc stuff, because for some people new to a certain class, they have no idea how much "a lot" or STR is, etc. Actually, I think it looks best with the range system we have now (e.g. STR: 50-80) because it gives numbers to work off but without making the build so cookie-cutter. Below it we should add info for what each stat is for. On the other hand, a general explanation of why each stat matters for the class as a whole is good. One of my favorite guides ever is Akemi's Monk Guide, which I think is excellent and really covers all the ground needed for anyone who wants to be a monk. I suggest looking at that for an idea for our pages. --Steax
- I think it's okay to put the jobchange on the single class page. We're in a time were you don't have to matter with client page loading times just cause of images. But I don't like if to have the jobchange guide at statup. So you'd have to scroll down an unknown number of lines to get any other information. And you just need the guide once or twice yourself. But the "stats" I wrote didn't mean "1 Str, 50 Int, 80Dex ..." but "Strength just increases weight limit. Agi increases ASPD and Flee. Int increases SP and SP rec ...". Because they aren't the same for every class. But for your idea I'd say a section "Builds" as parent of those before you list the single builds.
Renewal Preparation
This will be (somewhat of) a basis for 3rd Classes. Of course names will be changed if iRO will change them (e.g. Minstrel).
| Novice | |||||||||||
| Novice | |||||||||||
| First Jobs | |||||||||||
| Swordman | Mage | Archer | Merchant | Thief | Acolyte | ||||||
| Second Jobs | |||||||||||
| Knight | Crusader | Wizard | Sage | Hunter | Bard/Dancer | Blacksmith | Alchemist | Assassin | Rogue | Priest | Monk |
| Transcendent Novices | |||||||||||
| High Novice | |||||||||||
| Transcendent First Jobs | |||||||||||
| High First Class | |||||||||||
| Transcendent Second Jobs | |||||||||||
| Lord Knight | Paladin | High Wizard | Scholar | Sniper | Minstrel/Gypsy | Mastersmith | Biochemist | Assassin Cross | Stalker | High Priest | Champion |
| Third Jobs | |||||||||||
| Rune Knight | Royal Guard | Warlock | Sorcerer | Ranger | Minstrel/Wanderer | Mechanic | Genetic | Guillotine Cross | Shadow Chaser | Arch Bishop | Sura |
| Expanded Jobs | |||||||||||
| TaeKwon Kid | Ninja | Gunslinger | Super Novice | ||||||||
| Soul Linker | TaeKwon Master | Ninja Second Job | Gunslinger Second Job | ||||||||
--Blackyoukai 15:03, 22 August 2010 (MDT)